DUST Search - Tanks vs. AV: A constructive discussion.

All Channels

General Discussions

Tanks vs. AV: A constructive discussion.

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1205	Posted - 2013.09.04 13:15:00 - [1] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: yesterday I met a Soma right after 1.4 patch and it took me 6 proto swarm shots to solo him. his fit was obviously great but his driving was still terrible, he was standing still all day while I only jumped out of cover to fire my missile. Soma - armor 6 proto swarms - 18k+ dmg Max soma tank i have seen is 8k no rep It wouldnt have survived a clip let alone 2 You are full of ****
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1205	Posted - 2013.09.04 13:24:00 - [2] - Quote 1. Is it expected to lose/destroy a tank in a given match or is it simply intended to be matched by other tanks? Yes, if adv/proto AV is on the field i do expect to lose it in my basic tank and mods, it maybe able to survive if i can run the other way and have everything active to try and tank the incoming damage, if its AV nades its instant and next to unavoidalbe due to joe nameth thrwoing, swarms bend around corners still lock on through cover and fire invisible missiles so its hard to survive them, FG/PL require aiming thus not used as much 2. Are tank users counting on being able to use tanks every game for the entire game since their SP are primarily distributed into tanks? Vehicles are a specilization, if we cant use them every game then whats the point in playing? 3. Is there something to say about the amount of SP/ISK required to run tanks vs. AV? Vehicles cost way more ISK and SP than AV ever will at this moment in time, AV can have weapons which deal more damage than any turret in the game for a fraction of the price and for a fraction of the SP, i can spend 2mil SP into proto swarms and fit it on a skinweave suit and kill all the vehicles in the game 4. Before 1.4 were things balanced? lolno, basic vehicles vs proto AV, also super OP swarms getting more buffs and still broken as ****
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1206	Posted - 2013.09.04 13:50:00 - [3] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Soma - armor 6 proto swarms - 18k+ dmg your math assumes I had 3 proto damage mods fitted, all skills at max and all missiles actually hit instead of curshing into the ground because of poor pathing or spinning around for unknown reason. biased opinion is biased. Takahiro Kashuken wrote: You are full of **** u mad? Nope I just now know if i see you in game you are a bad player who needs 6+ proto volleys to kill a militia tank
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1206	Posted - 2013.09.04 13:51:00 - [4] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: 1. Is it expected to lose/destroy a tank in a given match or is it simply intended to be matched by other tanks? Yes, if adv/proto AV is on the field i do expect to lose it in my basic tank and mods, it maybe able to survive if i can run the other way and have everything active to try and tank the incoming damage, if its AV nades its instant and next to unavoidalbe due to joe nameth thrwoing, swarms bend around corners still lock on through cover and fire invisible missiles so its hard to survive them, FG/PL require aiming thus not used as much 2. Are tank users counting on being able to use tanks every game for the entire game since their SP are primarily distributed into tanks? Vehicles are a specilization, if we cant use them every game then whats the point in playing? 3. Is there something to say about the amount of SP/ISK required to run tanks vs. AV? Vehicles cost way more ISK and SP than AV ever will at this moment in time, AV can have weapons which deal more damage than any turret in the game for a fraction of the price and for a fraction of the SP, i can spend 2mil SP into proto swarms and fit it on a skinweave suit and kill all the vehicles in the game 4. Before 1.4 were things balanced? lolno, basic vehicles vs proto AV, also super OP swarms getting more buffs and still broken as **** Concerning point 3 now you have Ammo AND overheat turret damage will be buffed but that'll only benifit vechile to vechile warefare! We dont know that We have ammo but my HAV cant climb up stairs
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1217	Posted - 2013.09.04 16:05:00 - [5] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Toby Flenderson wrote: When I see a tank I realize that it has the potential to control the rest of a match if gone unchallenged. I make it my mission to try and destroy it even if it means taking 5+ deaths. My militia SL and packed AV grenades are simply not enough to hurt a tank. Unless I have the rest of my squad to back me up (none of which have any more firepower than I do), then the tank mows down my team for the whole match. LOL no You're admitting to bringing weak AV to the table. Why should your MLT swarm launcher and ADV AV grenades be any more powerful because out of at least 4 people, you bring weak AV to the table, and I have my Gunnlogi? Why should I get nerfed for your decision to not have much AV? This is what pisses me off about the community, and CCP's tendencies to listen to a specific group. I've gone 41-1 in a Gunnlogi getting spider tanked. The other team literally did not have better than MLT / STD AV. We're talking about 8 or so guys launching those weak swarms at me because not a single other person on their team had anything better than that. Now, they were launching explosive weaponry at a shield tank. They obviously won't have the explosive damage bonus on that. I had an armor tank behind me with a shield transporter constantly boosting my shield too. As such, the enemy team had to blow up that tank first before they could destroy me. That being said, why should your admittedly weak AV get buffed at all? In that case, everything CCP put into the game was working as intended. Explosive weaponry was shrugged off, and I was getting remote reps. Why should I in effect take another nerf? Yet you can sit there and complain about the proto till the mcc s come home, if a team fields a whole squads worth of av it should take you down, or at least make you soil your pants. Tanks need more defined roles, not just murdering entire squads with ease! But if that other team doesn't bring enough AV, why shouldn't I walk all over them? Can you answer that? Why should CCP balance the game over modes and matchmaking that don't affect the overall grand scheme of things? Depends on your definition of not enough av, not enough 3-4 you should be able to out tank them sure, 5-6 you need to be moving around, making retreats and tactical advances, at 8+ then you should be on the back foot. In the current sizes it should scale like this for adv gear, once we get 64+ then prehaps a little more can be accepted! As for how difficult to shoot with a rail turret, no more than hitting infantry with a forge gun! The game should never be a case of walking over them, it just makes you sound ignorant, which I why im looking forward to 1.5, tanks will hopefully be made into assets powerful ones at that but you wont be able to be ai, av, aa and everything inbetween! Are you serious? A FG has more damage and bigger splash than my railgun turret, its easy with a FG i can do it with militia FG Also that game 8+ ppl with milita AV that was militaia/basic, if anything like adv/proto comes on the field its ****** i would love to scale it up but we have no proto tanks
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1218	Posted - 2013.09.04 16:22:00 - [6] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Well im speaking from my experience the smaller reticle was most helpful, well miltia should require 50% more than at adv, while proto requires 50% less, I would rate current tanks as adv, a tier under needs considered! The tanks we have now are basic Enforcers by meta level are advanced by they are more like advanced militia tank
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1227	Posted - 2013.09.05 12:41:00 - [7] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Jack McReady wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Soma - armor 6 proto swarms - 18k+ dmg your math assumes I had 3 proto damage mods fitted, all skills at max and all missiles actually hit instead of curshing into the ground because of poor pathing or spinning around for unknown reason. biased opinion is biased. Takahiro Kashuken wrote: You are full of **** u mad? Nope I just now know if i see you in game you are a bad player who needs 6+ proto volleys to kill a militia tank your butthurt comments all over the forum only insult your own intelligence. but please go on and amuse us even more. a maximized SP wise soma fit for max tank can absorb 5 proto swarms without exploding against someone without damage mods. not to mentioned if it is spider tanked where another vehicle can step in to prevent damage. I let you figure out yourself how to do it. all 3 damage mods would change is reduce the amount of shoots to kill it from 6 to 4. At least i dont have to make stuff up to try and prove a point but in your case you make it up and fail with the point anyways If a soma was that good then madrugars wouldnt be used and all we would see is somas but suprisingly i dont see somas in PC matches it always maddys Could you tell me why that is the case? No you cant because you dont know what you are talking about
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1227	Posted - 2013.09.05 12:43:00 - [8] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Well im speaking from my experience the smaller reticle was most helpful, well miltia should require 50% more than at adv, while proto requires 50% less, I would rate current tanks as adv, a tier under needs considered! The tanks we have now are basic Enforcers by meta level are advanced by they are more like advanced militia tank They're functionally the equivalent of Standard Assault suits vs. Medium Frame. They're a Standard "Specialised" model instead of the basic version. Standard specialised Its why the enforcers have less CPU/PG than standard but 1 more slot and a bonus to long range bombardment yet its for lolmissiles and blasters while it costs more SP and ISK to have one Its advanced militia at best
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1232	Posted - 2013.09.05 14:42:00 - [9] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: At least i dont have to make stuff up to try and prove a point but in your case you make it up and fail with the point anyways If a soma was that good then madrugars wouldnt be used and all we would see is somas but suprisingly i dont see somas in PC matches it always maddys Could you tell me why that is the case? No you cant because you dont know what you are talking about another biased butthurt post without any valid points from you, but I didnt expected something else than a reply of no value. we have several madrugar drivers in dust uni that have fits able to absorb 6 proto swarms with 3 dmg mods and survive. so some guys in a training corp can do it but you dont? well bad news for you, if there is anyone that has no clue than it is obviously only you. another biased butthurt post without any valid points from you Just keep making stuff up because its easier for you I would love to see these tanks survive 6 proto swarms but its always talk and hearsay but not from the drivers always from infantry saying how they have seen it or they were the swarm user and it survived I have yet to see a vid of a madrugar surviving 6+ proto swarms and still keep on tanking and mowing down infantry From my tanking experience its called running away, i cannot be still and take 6 proto 3dmg mod unless i am out of range or the missiles actually hit cover and not me so it looks like the swarms can lock on and keep firing but nothing ever hits
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1232	Posted - 2013.09.05 15:23:00 - [10] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Jack McReady wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: At least i dont have to make stuff up to try and prove a point but in your case you make it up and fail with the point anyways If a soma was that good then madrugars wouldnt be used and all we would see is somas but suprisingly i dont see somas in PC matches it always maddys Could you tell me why that is the case? No you cant because you dont know what you are talking about another biased butthurt post without any valid points from you, but I didnt expected something else than a reply of no value. we have several madrugar drivers in dust uni that have fits able to absorb 6 proto swarms with 3 dmg mods and survive. so some guys in a training corp can do it but you dont? well bad news for you, if there is anyone that has no clue than it is obviously only you. another biased butthurt post without any valid points from you Just keep making stuff up because its easier for you I would love to see these tanks survive 6 proto swarms but its always talk and hearsay but not from the drivers always from infantry saying how they have seen it or they were the swarm user and it survived I have yet to see a vid of a madrugar surviving 6+ proto swarms and still keep on tanking and mowing down infantry From my tanking experience its called running away, i cannot be still and take 6 proto 3dmg mod unless i am out of range or the missiles actually hit cover and not me so it looks like the swarms can lock on and keep firing but nothing ever hits what is the purpose of you repeating the same nonsense over and over? surviving 6 proto hits and tanking it to proceed mowing down infantry are two entirely different things. it is possible to survive 6 proto swarms, that is the point. you are not supposed to be invincible but I guess you are one of those scrubs that think they should be able to solo everything in a tank and then wonder why the AV nades of a whole squad you tried to camp are hurting you. btw the time to kill a high durability fit is almost 20s of continous uninterrupted shooting with swarms. what have you or your team done in that time frame? the answer to this question is the cause of your butthurt. If i could solo everything in a tank it would be a proto tank with proto mods where i would be able to tank 6 proto swarms because proto hull/mods 20s lolno, instant AV crutch nades, lai dai are the best 2k damage per nade and you never miss What has my team done? well pub matches dont count only PC does but even then to kill a proto suit before he can launch all 3 nades takes longer to do in general also they can be anywhere at any time and not show up or even show up because i use a scanner but hide behind something and spam them because lol they never miss Back to the point of you making stuff up, even with proto swarms and not prof 5 its at least 2k damage a volley, if you are not using dmg mods then you are doing it wrong again, plus swarms lock on even faster at level 5 fire faster and still fire invisible missiles which still go around corners This invincible soma i have yet to see, every tanker i know doesnt use militia tanks because they get popped easily, i have yet to see one in a PC match and the ones i see in pub matches get killed very easily I could say easily my maddy survived 2 sets of proto swarms and it has done, what im not telling you is that i was up a mountain behind cover but my turret was peaking out so i could still fire shots, the swarms could still lock onto me because of the turret but the missiles fire towards the bottom of my tank and i see the explosion of the missiles on the rocks so i survived 12proto swarms Your story has more ******* holes in it than swiss cheese hence why i call it BS and made up

Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1232	Posted - 2013.09.05 15:29:00 - [11] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Stop throwing insults at each other like 2 year olds, its degrading and only serves to diminish your intelligence!! Sometimes tanks can be op, sometimes they can be up, end of that discussion!! How do you think tanks can be made fair for enemy infantry, and dont mean nerf this mcnuggets out of everything!! How can a tank be a tank without steam rolling the opposite side? The only time a basic tank is OP is when ther is next to no AV on the enemy team which is ther fault and not mine When its UP is when anything over adv pops up because we do not have adv/proto mods/hulls Also swarms/av nades are the biggest crutches in the game and require no aim while still have massive faults with the weapon, invisible missiles/locking through cover/able to look up not lose lock so you can fire missiles when not looking at the target/tracking or the target is borked since the missiles track where the target used to be and not where it is/homing nades FG is pretty balanced as it is, requires some aim, more than the swarms and AV will ever need which is 0 Plasma cannon did get a buff in proj speed in 1.4 i have seen them about more and they do hit harder when they hit, requires the most aim so rarely used AV mines are never used, espc when homing AV nades deal more damage and never miss so why bother swapping to mines Give use proto hull/mods to compete with proto AV and we have a level playing field Pub matches should never be used to balance a weapon, its random, teams are random, forget about it Balance in PC where it counts, basic vehicles vs proto AV makes PC a right ******* annoyance
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1232	Posted - 2013.09.05 15:41:00 - [12] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: stuff is that how discussion with you look like? someone bring facts and arguments and you answer with several unrelated biased QQ? you not only failed at reading and answering accordingly, you also managed to write several answers with biased QQ and zero arguments in a row. I guess your ignorance and tunnelvision must be a blessing Facts what ***** facts? you didnt bring any, you made it up on the spot You told a story which more holes in it than swiss cheese and left out a bunch of details Basically you are a terrible terrible AV player and have no idea what you are doing Ive countered all your points, even made up a better story than you can do to prove your point wrong and its more ***** believable because it actually happens
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1237	Posted - 2013.09.06 11:02:00 - [13] - Quote Toby Flenderson wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Stop throwing insults at each other like 2 year olds, its degrading and only serves to diminish your intelligence!! Sometimes tanks can be op, sometimes they can be up, end of that discussion!! How do you think tanks can be made fair for enemy infantry, and dont mean nerf this mcnuggets out of everything!! How can a tank be a tank without steam rolling the opposite side? The only time a basic tank is OP is when ther is next to no AV on the enemy team which is ther fault and not mine When its UP is when anything over adv pops up because we do not have adv/proto mods/hulls Also swarms/av nades are the biggest crutches in the game and require no aim while still have massive faults with the weapon, invisible missiles/locking through cover/able to look up not lose lock so you can fire missiles when not looking at the target/tracking or the target is borked since the missiles track where the target used to be and not where it is/homing nades FG is pretty balanced as it is, requires some aim, more than the swarms and AV will ever need which is 0 Plasma cannon did get a buff in proj speed in 1.4 i have seen them about more and they do hit harder when they hit, requires the most aim so rarely used AV mines are never used, espc when homing AV nades deal more damage and never miss so why bother swapping to mines Give use proto hull/mods to compete with proto AV and we have a level playing field Pub matches should never be used to balance a weapon, its random, teams are random, forget about it Balance in PC where it counts, basic vehicles vs proto AV makes PC a right ***** annoyance You must be joking calling swarms and AVs the biggest crutches in Dust. Swarm launchers are primary weapons. They cannot attack infantry and they are completely worthless for anything aside from destroying vehicles. Why would CCP make them also difficult to aim and operate doing the only thing they're supposed to do? Aside from a SMG or scrambler pistol the player is completely defenseless to the enemies while they try to move into view of the tank. This is dangerous enough and almost suicidal so yeah they should be able to shoot/lock with some wiggle room around corners. AV grenades are also worthless against infantry and can't be thrown very far. If someone drives a tank through infantry and doesn't expect to be challenged by something then they're just an idiot. I sense that tank users expect to be invincible and chase infantry down and then get annoyed when they toss AV grenades at them. Play smarter if you're being killed by AV grenades. Just imagine how vulnerable the SL/AV grenade users are while tankers sit cozy in a metal box with 5-10k hp. The ones chasing tanks with AV grenades deserve medals. Missiles still being invisible - broken rendering Missiles still following around corners/cover because it tracks to where you were locked on then follows you after it has reached that point - broken tracking Can lock on through cover even if you can only see a part of the tank because the square pops up - broken lock on Can lock on and then look away for a few seconds before you lose lock, i use this when behind cover, so i lock on to part of the tank look up and then fire, i should lose lock as soon as i look away - broken lock on Can lock on and fire while bunny hopping - Basically an RPG on your shoulder so why the ** should you be allowed to do this? If you are fine with the above problems then you are a crutch user who wants to keep an OP weapon AV nades - homing crutch, means you can spam behind cover and never miss, you can even throw it past the tank and it will home in on it, more damage than AV mines, more damage than any of the large turrets Why cant we just have it where you throw the AV nade at the tank, if you miss the tank its because you have bad aim, the AV nade would explode on the hull itself and if you miss it disappears after 2seconds If you need the homing crutch then you are a bad player with no aim

Copyright © 2013-2024, Chribba - OMG Labs. All Rights Reserved. - perf 0,03s, ref 20241122/1729
EVE-Online™/DUST514™ and EVE/DUST514 imagery © CCP.

bitcoin: 1CHRiBBArqpw5Yz7x5KS2RRtN5ubEn5gF

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online/DUST514, the EVE/DUST514 logo, EVE/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to OMG Labs to use EVE Online/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, OMG Labs. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.